Kathi: Hiya Rich!
Rich Tatum: Yo!
Kathi: How are you?
Rich Tatum: Doing good.
Rich Tatum: Back from Disney™ Finally.
Rich Tatum: :-)
Kathi: I forgot! That's where you were!
Rich Tatum: Or, is it Disney®?
Rich Tatum: Yes,.
Kathi: how was it?
Rich Tatum: Spent 3˝days at Epcot and a day at Disney-MGM Studios.
Rich Tatum: Very relaxing. Weather was drizzly all the time (Hurricane Hugo) and the lines were very short.
Rich Tatum: It was a good vacation.
Rich Tatum: Didn't take any pictures until Tuesday, then I did a flying tour of Epcot and took probably five or six rolls.
Kathi: Didja meet Mickey Mouse?
Rich Tatum: :-)
Rich Tatum: Nah.
Rich Tatum: Woulda prolly been a girl under the rubber suit anyhow.
Kathi: ROFL
Rich Tatum: Jennifer used to work at DisneyWorld, so there were no illusions for me.
Kathi: Don't tell me that she was Mickey …
Rich Tatum: Nah …
Rich Tatum: She was a tour guide for The Great Movie Ride at MGM Studios.
Kathi: sounds like a fun job.
Rich Tatum: She loved it. Really misses the job.
Rich Tatum: She still has the script memorized.
Kathi: <g> That kind of thing, you never forget
Kathi: Can I ask you something?
Rich Tatum: Sure!
Kathi: Since you work for CT, this probably wouldn't ever happen to you … what would you do if the company you work for was to promote something (and expect your involvement in doing so) that was contrary to your beliefs?
Rich Tatum: Depdends on how contrary we're talking about.
Rich Tatum: I philosophically disagree with almost everybody about something — and especially with my employers.
Rich Tatum: But if they wanted me to condone something illegal, I'd probably have to resign and go to the authorities. If it was something immoral, same thing but probably wouldn't have to talk to the authorities.
Kathi: We're going to have web site guests who advocate things like reincarnation and the occult.
Kathi: I might be able to sidestep the issue if it didn't directly involve me … tho I wouldn't feel too good about that, either.
Rich Tatum: Hmm …
Rich Tatum: Paul spoke at Mars Hill in Athens Greece, where there were idols established for every religion known to the Grecians and Romans of the day.
Rich Tatum: Where he spoke, it was an open air auditorium put there for anybody to address the crowed.
Rich Tatum: The multiple statues existed because the people of that day were deeply religious, but also deeply paranoid and were afraid that they might miss out on honoring some deity or another, and so they established an altar for the "unknown god" … just in case.
Rich Tatum: When Paul spoke on Mars Hill his presence there, in that crowd and on that hill, was not a tacit acceptance of the Grecian's paranoia and misguided faith(s).
Kathi: yes, I've read this … it's Acts 17, right?
Rich Tatum: And because nobody apparently responded to his address, some like to say this was Paul's biggest failure.
Rich Tatum: Yeah, I think so.
Rich Tatum: But I like to think that Paul happened to give us a model for how we can live and work in a completely secular world and still retain our distinction.
Rich Tatum: You can be "among" but not "of."
Rich Tatum: If you were a shoemaker, would you not sell shoes to these people because you disagreed with them?
Kathi: mmmmmm …. but what I'd be doing in this situation would be like Paul saying to everyone around … "let's all go and listen to this wonderful speaker about <pick a deity> … this person is the premier expert in all the world on holistic spirituality"
Rich Tatum: Well, I've always been told "If you don't like to wash dishes—the first time you're asked to wash the china, break everything.
Rich Tatum: They'll never ask again.
Rich Tatum: :-)
Kathi: That's entirely tempting. :-)
Rich Tatum: :-)
Kathi: <sigh> I need a new job.
Rich Tatum: Okay, here's a passage that could be helpful for you.
Kathi: In fact, I think I'm being led to leave here … but I can't afford to simply go. It's not just this, it's 100 things here at work … plus my son's school can't deal with him and I'm being faced with either suing them or homeschooling again.
Rich Tatum: What I'm about to give you should not be construed as 'a word from God' about your job or this particular situation.
Rich Tatum: And you should study this passage yourself to see how it applies in your context.
Rich Tatum: But here goes:
Nevertheless, each one should retain the place in
life that the Lord assigned to him and to which God
has called him. This is the rule I lay down in all
the churches.
Was a man already circumcised when he was called?
He should not become uncircumcised. Was a man
uncircumcised when he was called? He should not be
circumcised. Circumcision is nothing and
uncircumcision is nothing. Keeping God's commands
is what counts.
Each one should remain in the situation which he
was in when God called him.
Were you a slave when you were called? Don't let it
trouble you — although if you can gain your freedom,
do so. For he who was a slave when he was called by
the Lord is the Lord's freedman; similarly, he who
was a free man when he was called is Christ's
slave. You were bought at a price; do not become
slaves of men.
Brothers, each man, as responsible to God, should
remain in the situation God called him to.
1 Corinthians 7:17-24
Kathi: :::shaking head in wonder:::
I read that passage last night, Rich, and wondered about it as it relates to my situation. This is too weird :-)
Rich Tatum: You can click here to see the passage …
Rich Tatum: God just may require you to change your job, but until he does, or until he provides the opportunity, or until you just can't take it any more, do what your hand finds to do (e.g., what God gives you to do) with all your strength.
Kathi: I'm afraid I may not be able to take it anymore far sooner than the opportunity arrives :-)
Kathi: "God give me patience …. RIGHT NOW" <g>
Rich Tatum: Pray that God helps you find creative ways to do your job without compromising your ethics. If your boss asks you to write copy that you just can't write because it would be a lie, you'll have to figure that one out on your own. But ust remember that copyrighters aren't putting their words on paper, they are articulating their employers wishes.
Rich Tatum: In much the same way that the slaves Paul addressed were not acting out their own wishes when running errands for their owners — they were simply acting out their masters
Rich Tatum: wishes.
Rich Tatum: In some ways, there are few stronger ways of witnessing than seeing a Christian accept humiliation with grace. I'm sure that everyone who knows you will be aware of what's going on inside.
Kathi: hmmmmm I understand the principle, but I don't know if I can do it. "I was just following orders" is a pretty scary way to live, to me.
In some ways being a pagan was far, far, far easier than I ever realized.
Rich Tatum: You have to draw lines.
Rich Tatum: You will not be an instrument to break the law, commit imorral acts, etc.
Rich Tatum: but whereever you draw those lines, make sure you can adhere to them.
Rich Tatum: As someone said to me, "You have to choose the sword you want to fall on."
Kathi: LOL I suppose that's true.
Rich Tatum: Draw the line and be sure that you're willing to sacrifice your job and reputation to not cross it.
Rich Tatum: Up to that point, though, trust in God to handle everything for you.
Rich Tatum: Think about Daniel, who cheefully served the Egyptians for so many years — even though the Pharoahs were opressively cruel.
Rich Tatum: Uh …
Rich Tatum: Joseph I mean.
Kathi: I guess the problem is that with the exception of most things illegal, I've never drawn lines before. Remember, I'm coming from a background where most everything was acceptable.
Rich Tatum: :-)
Rich Tatum: Ayup.
Rich Tatum: I can imagine.
Kathi: In a lot of ways, I really don't know where the line is between "right" and "realistic".
My boss thinks I'm crazy. And I have carefully avoided making any mention of this issue, so far … or any others like it.
Kathi: guess it's the kind of thing that comes with experience, huh?
Rich Tatum: I suppose, experience and much prayer.
Kathi: :::nodding:::
speaking of which, I had the most amazing experience the other night …
Rich Tatum: Yeah?
Kathi: I simply cannot, by virtue of space and children, pray aloud at home if they are there. So I've gotten in the habit of taking the dog for long walks in the evenings and praying aloud.
Kathi: Sunday night, I all of a sudden started praying in another language. It lasted for a few minutes … not sure how long, because it weirded me out a little … wasn't expecting it, you know?
Rich Tatum: Wow!
Kathi: And I felt … well, I don't know how to describe how I felt.
Kathi: It happened again last night, too, same circumstances.
Rich Tatum: :-)
Rich Tatum: The Spirit makes utterance when we know how what to pray for ….
Rich Tatum: Know not … I mean.
Rich Tatum: Praise God!
Rich Tatum: Did you feel like freaking out?
Kathi: So now a lot of my questions on that subject are answered … :-)
yes … and that was the situation the first time … I didn't know how to say what I was trying to say, and there it was.
Rich Tatum: Well, like the old saw goes: Better felt than telt.
Kathi: I was a little weirded out by it … but not too badly, partly because I've done so much reading, and talked to you, and heard people at church speaking in tongues, etc.
Plus I just had … and still have … this sense of … well, see, I can't explain it.
Kathi: peace and passion? all rolled into one?
Rich Tatum: :-)
Kathi: I can say without a doubt that many amazing things have happened in my life, and this experience ranks as #2 … with #1 being the restoration of my hearing.
Rich Tatum: Wow ….
Rich Tatum: That's really awesome!
Kathi: I just wish that someone had taken me by the hand and told me this 15 years ago.
Rich Tatum: that's funny.
Kathi: why's that?
Rich Tatum: A lot of new Christians have that reaction …
Rich Tatum: :-)
Rich Tatum: "Why didn't I 'get it!????'"
Rich Tatum: "What was I thinking ?????"
Kathi: uh-huh …
Rich Tatum: It's weird, though, how violently unreactive some people are to the Gospel, then they finally have this breakthrough, like you did, and are amazed that this was sitting in front of their nose the entire tiem.
Kathi: phone …
Kathi: I was violently opposed for years … but before that … I could have been reached.
Rich Tatum: Isn't it odd, though, how you were actually in church for some time and the truth of it didn't penetrate. (Or, it's possible this was a "dead" church?).
Kathi: this was a very, very dead church that I grew up in.
Rich Tatum: Sad.
Kathi: It was very sad, in retrospect I can't believe that people bothered to show up …. but … there was good coffee and donuts after services.
Rich Tatum: Well, it's hard not to get out of bed for free coffee and donutes.
Rich Tatum: :-)
Kathi: that's my point exactly!
Kathi: besides, services started at 11 … most folks out of bed already.
