[...]Examining Assemblies of God statistics on growth via BlogRodent[...]…

[...]Examining Assemblies of God statistics on growth via BlogRodent[...]…

[...]Examining Assemblies of God statistics on growth via BlogRodent[...]…

I have seen many changes over the years but I believe that the Assemblies is becoming the church of the “I remember when”. I have taught and spoken at many churches and anymore when I ask the question is the Spirit moving the answer is “I remember when”, the Spirit use to move, I remember when people were healed at the alter. Over the last few years instead of giving the people the answer of the Holy Spirit and the being filled with the Spirit we are even afraid to mention it due to the fact that we might scare them off.

When I see Assembly churches teaching the Apostles Creed to our young girls instead of “We Believe” and when the Missionette leaders are told not to follow the example of praying with the girls to receive the Holy Spirit because praying for them to receive the Holy Spirit should not be done in the Church.

My heart cries to see the Holy Spirit leave our denomination but no one will listen. So I am on my knees praying that we wake up and get back to living the 16 Fundamental Truths under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

Hey, I only got to skim the above article, which strides along with focus, but then offers honestly posted speculation. Thanks for being honest about that…

Thank you for pointing to an emphasis in discipleship. I agree whole-heartedly with evangelism, but newborn infants need milk fairly quickly after birth, or life ceases. There are already enough adult children in the United States of America as it is…

TO THE KING!

In Christ,
Bryan

I agree with most of what you write, you are straightforward and honest, but not insulting.

I have been an AOG pastor’s wife for approximately 30 years. My husband has been in various positions of ministry, (youth, Assoc., Senior).

From what I have observed, those statistics are many times what the pastor hopes will happen the next year, not what actually is. I don’t believe they intentionally lie, but there is much more attention and respect paid to the pastors of larger churches….I liken it to the business world- money and people.

I have become pretty disappointed over the years at the way leadership in many of our churches do not follow Jesus’ command to “Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul and strength; and love your neighbor as yourself.”

Without getting specific, I have found that if you disagree with certain people, and especially if they perceive that they have “position” because a relative is a superintendent, or they have a friend at headquarters, these “ministers of the gospel” can become pushy, abusive, screaming maniacs. Also, some pastors and their wives seem to be some of the worst gossips I have ever seen.

In other words, not much “Fruit of the Spirit” going on. How do we expect God to bless when we act like this?

Instead of all the programs, why don’t we have more accountability, zeal to see the kingdom of God grow, not “my kingdom”. I know it seems basic, but a mutual respect for everyone, (not just those with huge churches or with connections). It seems to me , that’s how Jesus ministered.

What is very disturbing to me, is that people say to you , Rich, that you can say the things you do because you are not an Assemblies pastor, like we are in the Mafia. Are we ruled by fear of man?

Let me clarify: There are wonderful pastors, wives, superintendents, etc. in the Assemblies.

It just seems that as a whole, we are becoming much more like the world that we used to preach against and heading in a direction that we want God to bless, not following after God’s heart.

God help us!

Lucy

We found your post both provocative and helpful in our own conversations on these issues.

Having said that, I want to respond to your concern about the “failure” of evangelism among the AOG.

As I read your numbers, evangelism seems to be working just fine among the AOG, if by “evangelism” we mean leading people to make decisions for Christ. In 1997, admittedly a peak year, the AOG reported a new conversion for every 4 existing adherents. That’s amazing! Your data indicate that the AOG have recorded double digit new conversion rates for every one of the last 25 years ranging from 14% to 25% per year! If true and reliable, those numbers are incredible. Yet you conclude that “the A/G’s evangelism efforts have failed” and “we are in seriously bad shape as an evangelistic enterprise.”

The AOG is growing at a steady rate of about 3% per year. Yes, churches are closing and net gains in terms of number of churches are down, but the overall denomination has more than doubled in the past 25 years! Many denominations would be delighted to realistically project adding 3 million adherents in the next 25 years based on recent trends. Members of AOG churches clearly DO believe in evangelism and excel at doing it despite your lament to the contrary.

The real problem these data highlight is one of “disciple-making” or “assimilation,” which you also note. That is, most of the people who are noted as making commitments for Christ are not becoming members or adherents of AOG churches. It looks like about 27% of new conversions DO become adherents, while the remainder (73%) do not. But we’d have to have similar data from other denominations to know whether this is better than average, about average, or worse than average. In the absence of a meaningful context it’s hard to know. My guess is the Southern Baptist Convention would be a good comparison group b/c of their emphasis on evangelism.

If the AOG had retained everyone one of their new converts over the past 25 years (i.e., seen them become adherents), I estimate they’d have 10.3 million adherents by now rather than 2.8 million. The data presented here do not support inferences about what happened to the missing 7.5 million. We can posit many different theories, but they’re all just speculation that would require other data to substantiate. But it would certainly be worth finding out what happens to the “missing” 7.5 million.

Some theories that occur to me about the “missing” 7.5 million:

a. They go to other churches (AOG is building the larger kingdom (POS)). What a gift this is to the larger kingdom of God and to other denominations that are less effective at evangelism!

b. Some of them are phantom conversions (Churches pad their numbers to look good on the denomination’s highest priority (NEG)). This is a fact of life among groups that emphasize evangelism to the exclusion of disciple-making.

c. The conversions don’t “stick” (New converts do not become disciples and “fall away” (NEG)). Another fact of life among groups that emphasize evangelism to the exclusion of disciple-making.

d. Some conversions are repeat conversions. (The same person “converts” several times as they grow in understanding (POS? NEG?)). To the extent that this is true, it may indicate a crude form of disciple-making.

My question for you: Is it necessary that every AOG convert become an AOG adherent for you to celebrate the AOG’s evangelistic work? (I hope not!)
If not, what % of them would have to become adherents for you to celebrate AOG’s evangelistic work?

It may be true that the AOG should increase its emphasis on genuine spiritual transformation rather than emphasizing conversion decisions, but GST is much harder to measure and count up across all its churches.

Blessings to you as you stimulate clearer and better thinking and strategizing in the church!

Karl L.

« Awesome analysis in my view, and highlights my concerns that the first word of the biblical salvation message has been lost. Jesus preached, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” The Apostles preached, “Repent! …” Even in “counseling” the woman caught in adultery Jesus said, “go and sin no more.” What I want to know is, where is the REPENT today? Have we so lost trust in the ability of the truth to set people free that we have abandoned it and now depend on psychological and sociological marketing techniques instead? … » [more]